Wikipedia:Reference desk/Language

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Language #eee #f5f5f5 #eee #aaa #aaa #aaa #00f #36b #000 #00f language Wikipedia:Reference desk/Language Language WP:RD/L

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March 11

Erfahrung vs. Erlebnis

Resolved: Was deleted due to self-resolution, re-rolled for posterity. --Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝) 05:16, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

• The above tag appears to be misplaced. Was it meant for the previous item? If so, please move it and delete this comment. --69.159.8.46 (talk) 04:10, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

It was not. Please see the edit summary for this diff. --Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝) 05:16, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

Did you mean this diff?  --Lambiam 09:45, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

Yes, that's the reason why I rolled it back. Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝) 12:32, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

Well, the custom is for the answer to be posted in the thread, so other people can read it later in the archive. In this case the original poster merely stated that "web search found the answer", but did not say what it was, and deleted the question. --69.159.8.46 (talk) 02:15, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

These two German words both translate as "experience", but they apparently connote different things. Can someone explain the difference? Thanks. 2601:640:104:3015:C29C:517:6486:FF2D (talk) 18:22, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

The first means experience as in "do you have any experience in...", whereas the second means experience as in "wow, that was some experience". --Viennese Waltz 10:06, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

I self-reverted the question because it had only been up briefly when I found the answer, and it didn't occur to me that it had enough interest to be worth cluttering up the desk with, but ok fine ;). Viennese Waltz, thanks for the answer, which is more illustrative than the one I found with web search. If anyone wants to know why I asked, the terms are used in this article about "user experiences" on computers, and is worthwhile reading for anyone involved with user interaction design or annoyed by its impredations as seen on the web these days. 2601:648:8202:96B0:54D9:2ABB:1EDB:CEE3 (talk) 21:53, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

March 12

Language

Hell! I'm a german human. How can i change the language?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yvonne0204 (talk • contribs) 02:40, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

By speaking differently, perhaps? —Tamfang (talk) 03:37, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

Try clicking here. 93.136.81.202 (talk) 04:33, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

Hah! I didn't know naked de: worked like that! --jpgordon^{𝄢𝄆 𝄐𝄇} 04:54, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

If you want to consult the English-language Wikipedia while having most menus and other widgets in German, you can set your language preference on your Special:GlobalPreferences page.  --Lambiam 05:50, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

← There's also a settings icon associated with 'Languages' on the sidebar to the left (I haven't tried it, though). 2606:A000:1126:28D:84FB:8212:21C8:8005 (talk) 05:58, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

It only changes the language preference for the current Wikipedia.  --Lambiam 16:12, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

Speaking obfuscation

A long time ago, I have stumbled upon that there are some speaking obfuscation ways such as adding syllables, changing sounds, etc. to make it harder for unauthorized people to understand what they are speaking.

What are articles on that? I forgot all detail including a proper term for it, so I can't find it anymore. Fortunny (talk) 20:15, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

Language game, Cant (language), and Pig Latin#In other languages may be relevant. Deor (talk) 20:42, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, I was looking exactly for it. Fortunny (talk) 10:48, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Doaitse (Dutch given name)

Noted computer scientist Doaitse Swierstra recently passed away,[1] RIP. When I had come across his name before I had assumed it was a normal Dutch given name, but now I notice all the search hits for "Doaitse" seem to be about him. Does anyone know the origin or meaning of this name? Thanks. 2601:648:8202:96B0:54D9:2ABB:1EDB:CEE3 (talk) 21:40, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

I can't tell you anything about the etymology, but the name seems to be Frisian rather than Dutch proper (see multiple web finds about a 19th-century Frisian poetry collection titled "Doaitse mei de Noardsde Balke" ('Doaitse with the northern harp') [2]. This [3] explains it as a "Frisian male given name", pointing to a Friesch Woordenboek [Frisian Dictionary] IV: 66/67 as a further source. Fut.Perf. ☼ 22:02, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

This reference on Friesian onomastics lists Doaitsen and variants thereof as a name for females. There seems (it is in Dutch, which I do not speak) to be an etymology. --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 09:04, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

OK from that source, there is this listing (which the listing for Doaitse seems to refer to, but it's hard to work out)

• "Doaitske. In Ned. spell. Dooitske, Doitske. In misspell. Dooitsche. G. Dooitsema, Doitsema, Doitsma, Doyt-sma. P. Doaitsewiel, Dooitsewiel (ook Dooi-tjewiel geschreven), meerke onder Tietjerk."

Translated that would be:

• "Doaitske. In Dutch spelling Dooitske, Doitske. In misspeling Dooitsche. G. Dooitsema, Doitsema, Doitsma, Doyt-sma. P. Doaitsewiel, Dooitsewiel (also written as Dooi-tjewiel ), small lake below Tietjerk." Fgf10 (talk) 09:16, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

I don't think that lake near Tytsjerk is related. It's just the next entry in the list. My guess, it's a wiel (a particular type of lake) named after somebody called Doaitse, who may have lived nearby. PiusImpavidus (talk) 17:22, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for finding that. The relevant entry can be translated as:

"Doaitse, Doaitsen. In Dutch spelling: Dooitse , Dooitsen , Doitse , Doitsen. Misspelled as Dooitze , Dooitzen, Doitze, Doitzen. Doytse, Doitzo, Doyttye, Doytge, Doytege, Doytze, Döythye, Doytje. Diminutive of Doaije"

Doaije, in turn, is listed on p.VII as an example among many names that are apparently shortened versions of other, originally Germanic names, but whose exact origins have been obscured. Fut.Perf. ☼ 09:49, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

Thanks everyone. It's interesting that my own web search (duckduckgo) didn't find any of this. I guess I'll break down and try google tomorrow. Did anyone notice if there is anyone else notable with this name? 2601:648:8202:96B0:54D9:2ABB:1EDB:CEE3 (talk) 10:20, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

Googling for "Doaitse(n) -Swierstra" finds a Dutch medical professional seemingly writing on sexual abuse in doctor - patient relations. The nl:WP does not seem to have an article on her.

There is also a racing horse (?, maybe a pedigree stud, so more sex of questionable consensuality) of that name and an old Frisian songbook from the 1850s entitled Doaitse with the Nordic bear. No idea about any notability... --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 14:10, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

According to this site (a good source when looking at names from the Netherlands), there were less than 5 people named Doaitse in the Netherlands in 2014, all male, never as first name, so the name is very rare. For less than 5 people, the site gives no detailed statistics for privacy reasons. It's suggested that the name ultimately derives from Liudolf, an old Germanic name. The name is indeed Frisian, and so is Swierstra. In Frisian names, diminutives are often used to turn masculine names into feminine names, but Frisian isn't always fussy about the gender of names. PiusImpavidus (talk) 17:22, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

March 14

Missing the verb for performing a lay

Hi, what does a bard do when he is performing a lay? Amond the Scandi bards or skalds, a lay would be a kvad (cognate with "quoth", I presume), and the word for making as well as performing a kvad is to "kvede". Is there any corresponding verb in English, Old English, Anglo-Saxon ... or de we go to "perform", "speak", "chant" or something similar? TiA! T 85.166.161.28 (talk) 00:59, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

"Recited" is one good word there... AnonMoos (talk) 01:40, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Hi, thank you. AFAICS this is norman/latin in origin, right? Nothing in "Ænglisc" English (etc.), or nothing in use today? T 85.166.161.28 (talk) 01:51, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Sing? It depends on exactly how it is performed. I could imagine both sung and spoken word style performances. --Khajidha (talk) 17:13, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

85.166.161.28 -- In lines 90 and 92 of the Beowulf poem, the verb forms sægde and cwæð are used, but I really couldn't tell you what the connotations of those words were for Old English speakers... AnonMoos (talk) 20:31, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Could someone please explain to this American what this thread is talking about? Jmar67 (talk) 06:47, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Per Lay#Poetry, a ballad or lyrical poem. Clarityfiend (talk) 07:44, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

The English word lay with the meaning of "ballad; lyrical poem" has only been around since Middle English, having been borrowed from French. The Old English cognate would have been lācan, meaning "to fight; to contend; to sing", which in turn is cognate with Old Norse leika (not kvad). The Old English cognate of kvede was cweþan, meaning "to say; to tell", which is indeed whence we get quethe, the past tense of which was quoth.--William Thweatt ^TalkContribs 18:30, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Hi everyone, mille grazie for the information from all of you; I'm researching for a fellow translator. I hope I understood you correctly: My take-away from all this is that the old AS words have fallen out of use today (or would be really, really anachronistic, esp. with the historical letters like æ and ð etc.), that there are no pre-Norman-root terms current today, and that we are left with the latin root terms (recite, chant, lay), or paraphrases (e.g. sing, say, speak, tell). ... A bit sad, somehow ... Anyway, thank you all. T 85.166.161.28 (talk) 02:54, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

Fixing period locations

No doubt Americans will see and immediately guess what that title means, but this Australian has been seeing that as an Edit summary on lots of articles on my Watchlist, including many purely Australian topics. Here, a period is a chunk of time, or something ladies experience, and that's it. I was truly puzzled for a while. How can you change the location of a chunk of time? It took me a while to figure out that it was about moving full stops. I wonder if the (no doubt American) editor who came up with that presumably automated Edit summary is even aware of it's lack of or confusing meaning in versions of English that aren't American? Do Americans reading this know what I'm talking about? I also wonder, how did American English and other versions of English come up with such totally different words for a simple dot? Full stop doesn't seem to explain it terribly well to me. HiLo48 (talk) 01:55, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

As an American it took me a while to figure out that "full stop" meant the punctuation mark that we call a period. As in, "that punctuation mark is called a period, period." Or as Gracie Allen used to say, "Never place a period where God has placed a comma". It never would have occurred to me that "period" could confuse anyone, but if that edit summary is left by a bot or script, maybe you could ask the maintainer to change it. 2601:648:8202:96B0:54D9:2ABB:1EDB:CEE3 (talk) 02:05, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Acually, I'm aware of the problem but (without devoting much thought to it) haven't come up with an elegant solution. Therefore, when I type an edit summary such as "adding missing ——", I alternate the uses of period and full stop in the blank. Or I just use "punct" as the edit summary. Deor (talk) 04:33, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Canadian here. We sometimes say "full stop," but only if we want to emphasise periods. It's kind of like how people get so confused when you ask about their pants across the pond. Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝) 05:21, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

I feel pain when I use "full stop" to designate the mark itself. It has always described to me the action that the mark has ("the sentence is now complete"). What I have just learned, however, is that there is also the term "full point", which defies logic. Jmar67 (talk) 07:02, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

The etymology of "period" may help explain these various usages.[4] ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 07:45, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

"America was thus clearly top nation, and History came to a ." (the final words of 1066 and All That, 1930). Alansplodge (talk) 13:49, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

@HiLo48: as presumably the editor in question, what would you prefer the summary be, that works for all articles? DannyS712 (talk) 23:06, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

How about something along the lines of "Fixing locations of periods/full stops"? Explicitly including the Wikilink might even help educate more readers. HiLo48 (talk) 23:12, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

If "punctuation" won't do, why not just say 'Fixing locations of "."' instead of all that verbosity? --69.159.8.46 (talk) 06:17, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

Let the edit summary be simply "copy edit". The diff shows what was changed. Jmar67 (talk) 19:48, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

Why is this editor even DOING all this? He or she has made a mess of a couple of articles I am watching, and I've had to change them back. Is there some odd WP guideline that he or she is attempting to implement? BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 06:40, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

He is right to be doing it. The full stop should indeed come before the reference. --Viennese Waltz 06:48, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

@BeenAroundAWhile: Please see Wikipedia:Citing sources#How to place an inline citation using ref tags and Wikipedia:Manual of Style#Punctuation and footnotes DannyS712 (talk) 07:14, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

I usually link to the specific MOS section related to the fix, or if there are too many, just MOS:PUNCT. I think AWB utters nothing at all when it moves clause-ending punctuation before refs (where it belongs). —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 08:22, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

This issue has been discussed before Talk:Year 2000 problem/Archive 3#Full stops in references. 2A00:23C5:318A:3100:38D1:3264:444D:A59A (talk) 11:02, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

I had to move the full stop inside the bracket to make that link work! 2A00:23C5:318A:3100:38D1:3264:444D:A59A (talk) 11:09, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

That's because the person who created the section named it with a trailing '.' (improperly). Section links need to match exactly. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 18:38, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

March 15

Heart = corona? (March 6)

The "corona" is the fiery ring around the sun which becomes visible during a total eclipse. The "diamond ring" effect occurs at the beginning and end of the eclipse when the sun shines through one of the moon's valleys. It's possible to see the corona at other times with the aid of a telescope and an opaque disc (astronomers do this to study the sun) but DON'T DO IT AT HOME as looking at the sun through a telescope causes instant blindness. 2A00:23C5:318A:3100:38D1:3264:444D:A59A (talk) 11:30, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

The basic meaning of the word "corona" in the Latin language is "crown" (also including wreaths and garlands worn on the head). Everything else is an extended or metaphorical meaning... AnonMoos (talk) 11:53, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

What's your question? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 13:02, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

I think the OP is trying to add to this March 6 thread. Alansplodge (talk) 15:58, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

There's nothing to stop the OP from adding it himself, though adding to things once they're archived is semi-fruitless. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 16:16, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

Even so, that has nothing to do with the question at hand. Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝) 16:33, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

What question? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 17:19, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

Baseball Bugs, the original question asked why the heart was referred to as "corona" and not what the "corona" is. Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝) 17:38, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

OK, you're talking about the March 6 item, not the OP's comment here. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 17:44, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

Well, it's Vote (X) for Change again, of course. Fut.Perf. ☼ 17:03, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

In that case, feel free to zap this section, as you've already blocked the OP. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 17:19, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

Pokhara place name meaning

What is the meaning of the place name Pokhara? Is it related in any way to the name Bokhara? Thanks, DuncanHill (talk) 20:01, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

Unfortunately, its not on the List of Nepal placename etymologies (if someone finds it, please consider adding). 107.15.157.44 (talk) 20:47, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

According to Wiktionary, Nepali पोखरा (Pokharā) comes from Sanskrit पुष्कर (puṣkara), meaning "blue lotus flower". Bokhara is an alternative form of Bukhara, which according to Wiktionary comes from Persian بخارا‎ (boxârâ), which is ultimately from Sogdian. The Encyclopædia Iranica mentions the Sogdian term βuxārak meaning "place of good fortune". If all of this is true, the similarity is a coincidence.  --Lambiam 20:50, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) पोखरा is a Nepali word descended from either of two Sanskrit words: पुष्कर ("blue lotus flower") (extended definition) or पौष्कर ("Vishnu's Blue color"; "relating to the lotus"; and, by extension, "lake, pond"). It is probably not related to Bokhara, but the city of Pushkar does have the same etymology.--William Thweatt ^TalkContribs 21:22, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

@Lambian: and @WilliamThweatt: Thank you both, much appreciated. DuncanHill (talk) 21:47, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

March 16

Better "late" than never?

When and why did "late" become a synonym for "dead"? (Q: Why is John late for the meeting? A: He has a good excuse; he's dead). My apologies for being only semi-serious, but I've always wondered about this. 2606:A000:1126:28D:9CD1:2A09:62D0:11F5 (talk) 05:59, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

Well, the OED Online can give us an idea of when, at least. The first citation for this sense being used is dated "a1422" which means "before 1422". (It reads: "Elizabeth, ye Wyfe of ye seid late Erle".) --69.159.8.46 (talk) 08:02, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

Interesting question. As to why, it is used in the sense of "of late", meaning "recent". A recent person is dead. Jmar67 (talk) 08:51, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

I've always assumed it meant recently dead. Having checked a couple of online dictionaries, none of them explicitly make that distinction (although the examples they give generally fit that use). Iapetus (talk) 10:18, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

Etymology Online does.[5] ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 13:23, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

I have alsways assumed this "late" means something like "occurring in the latter part of a period of time", in this case "some person during the last part of his/her/its time". So just as "the late thirties" are the last part of the thirties, the late Sir Thomas is the "last part of Sir Thomas" as it were. I've been overridden by history. 2003:F5:6F07:8800:3509:3F08:25F4:81F8 (talk) 17:00, 16 March 2020 (UTC) Marco PB

Logically, anyone who dies does so in the last part of his/her time. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 17:59, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

Does not mean the last part of his life but rather "the (recently) deceased Sir Thomas". Whereby "recent" can cover a lengthy period of time. We would probably not refer to "the late George Washington", however. Jmar67 (talk) 18:44, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

In the series of books, The No. 1 Ladies' Detective Agency by Alexander McCall Smith, set in Botswana, the characters use "late" as the general euphemism for "dead". Whether this is a common usage in Botswana, I don't know. --rossb (talk) 18:44, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

"Late" does have a euphemistic air, much like "dear departed". Jmar67 (talk) 18:55, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

Singular of Bituriges

Apparently the Bituriges were a Celtic tribe in ancient history. However, the article only ever mentions "Bituriges" in the plural. What is the singular form? JIP | Talk 17:39, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

The obvious hypothesis is "Biturix", but it may not be attested in ancient texts (my medium-sized Latin dictionary lists Bituriges as a plural word). Biturix is the name of a genus of moths... AnonMoos (talk) 17:52, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

Lucan's Pharsalia does indeed use "Biturix" (book 1, line 423). Adam Bishop (talk) 23:37, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

March 17

Silent-letter acronyms

I'm looking for any examples of acronyms/initialisms of the type where the letters are spoken separately (like FBI, CIA) but every one of the letters is silent in the words they represent. For clarity, in TKO the K represents knock, which is sounded with an N sound because the K is silent. We still say TKO, not TNO. I want an example where every element of the acronym is like the K in TKO. Does such a beast exist? -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 19:09, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

The first question might be, which initial consonants can be silent? It's not a long list. Examples include G (gnome), K (know), M (mnemonic), P (pneumatic) and W (write). Are there any others? <-Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots-> 00:21, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Also H as in "hour", "honest" and W as in "who", "whore"... AnonMoos (talk) 00:59, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Barenaked Ladies' "Crazy ABCs" has a few more, such as bdellium, maybe ouija ... ---Sluzzelin talk 01:11, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

A for 'orses, B for mutton, C for miles... DuncanHill (talk) 01:17, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Meaning what? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 02:22, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Hay, Beef, See... HiLo48 (talk) 03:39, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Sheep are cows? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 04:29, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

See Cockney Alphabet. Normally, you're Grandpunster Flash! ---Sluzzelin talk 04:43, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

I don't know whether you count "Europe"/"European" as words with a silent initial letter, Jack, but if you do, that might lead to an acronym fitting your conditions (perhaps in connection with "psychology", "psychiatry" ...). ---Sluzzelin talk 01:35, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

The "E" is not really silent in the sense of a historical sound which was deleted, leaving the letter which formerly wrote the sound in place. Instead an overall falling-sonority diphthong flipped to a rising-sonority diphthong... AnonMoos (talk) 01:53, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Isn't there some New York-based group of composers of mysterious and often incomprehensible yet seemingly wise psalms, the Knickerbockers' Gnomic Psalmists?  --Lambiam 05:05, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Ah yes, the KGP (NNS). :) -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 07:22, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

That's funny, a lot of these words are pronounced with an initial "n___", in at least four cases of different silent letters (Knickerbockers' Gnomic Mnemonic Pneumologists, the KGMP aka NNNN). ---Sluzzelin talk 10:56, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Ellipsis

"Then happened exactly what had always been our greatest fear ..." -- Considering the beginning (lacking a subject, in fact), is that proper English usage?--Hildeoc (talk) 19:58, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

I think it has a subject: "exactly what had always been our greatest fear". You could rewrite it as "Then exactly what had always been our greatest fear happened". -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 20:16, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

Yes, it's an example of inversion (linguistics). --69.159.8.46 (talk) 23:49, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

It's pseudo-poetic or pseudo-archaic English. I won't go as far as to say it's ungrammatical, but it wouldn't occur in normal modern usage. I guess I could imagine Jean-Luc Picard saying it in his Winston Churchill voice on Star Trek. 2601:640:105:A5EA:F50:4B35:8E5:C407 (talk) 23:09, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

Hildeoc -- it's an example of V2 word order, which used to be common in earlier English, and is still common in some circumstances in the German language today, but is rather limited in modern English. AnonMoos (talk) 01:04, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

It is not that uncommon: "First came the lack of toilet paper, then the worry their business might close for good"[6]; "In front of the building was the infinity pool, and next to the building was the spa."[7]. In the last sentence, you cannot even move the subjects to before the verbs (unless you are Yoda). You can do it with the first sentence, but it does not sound too good.  --Lambiam 04:57, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Lambiam, Columbusalive's sentence: "First came the lack of toilet paper, then [came] the worry their business might close for good" (in which "[came]" shows where "came" is unspoken but understood). Without inversion: "First the lack of toilet paper came, then the worry [came that] their business might close for good" (in which "[came that]" shows where "came that" is unspoken but understood). -- Hoary (talk) 05:56, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Yes, as I wrote, you can say that, but I think the inverted version flows better.  --Lambiam 06:42, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Lambiam -- it occurs in English in somewhat restricted contexts (as discussed in the V2 word order article); outside of those contexts, it can sound literary or archaic or affected. It occurs in a much wider range of contexts in German...

Hoary -- would you change Naked Came the Stranger to "The stranger came naked"? -- AnonMoos (talk) 08:03, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Why not? (Thanks for the link: I'd not heard of that book. As I gaze at Category:Literary forgeries, I recognize only seven of those listed. So I've just now discovered a new area of my ignorance of the world of letters, let alone the worlds in general.) -- Hoary (talk) 10:12, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

I'd like to see the rest of the sentence. The post-positioning of the subject can be effective when it immediately precedes the revelation of the fearsome event. Jmar67 (talk) 10:59, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Mining contact info from Japanese site.

In order to send OTRS request to the anime producer ClockUp I need a contact info, but their site is in Japanese. Anyone can lend a hand here? אילן שמעוני (talk) 23:44, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

The middle link (お問い合わせ) of the five links near the bottom of that page leads to their contact page. The widgets there, from top to bottom, are:

• お名前（会社名）: Name (company name)
• E-Mailアドレス: E-mail address
• カテゴリー: Category – a drop-down menu with a choice of:
  • 一般のお客様: as ordinary customer (the default)
  • 店舗様: as shop
  • 会社様: as company
• お問合せ内容: Content of the esteemed inquiry

All are required. Of the two buttons under the content box, the left one (送信) is Submit, while the right one (リセット) is Reset.  --Lambiam 04:41, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Thanks galore. אילן שמעוני (talk) 12:25, 18 March 2020 (UTC)